Modding Complexity List: What's Easy And What's Not

Nov 3, 2012 at 12:13 PM
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Seeing as Ideas come before implementation, I've decided to make this thread here. I don't feel like starting to write up a detailed list tonight, so I'll throw out some interim talking points:
-What TSC script is capable of on its own (which is more than most think)
-Why certain hacks are harder than others
-What our editing programs can and can't do at this stage
-What resources and skills are required to change a certain aspect
-What would be a good 5th thing

Try to keep it fairly objective, as we don't need two threads talking about the quality of ideas and products at the same time.
 
Nov 3, 2012 at 5:19 PM
Not anymore
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Seeing as Ideas come before implementation, I've decided to make this thread here. I don't feel like starting to write up a detailed list tonight, so I'll throw out some interim talking points:
-What TSC script is capable of on its own (which is more than most think)
-Why certain hacks are harder than others
-What our editing programs can and can't do at this stage
-What resources and skills are required to change a certain aspect
-What would be a good 5th thing

Try to keep it fairly objective, as we don't need two threads talking about the quality of ideas and products at the same time.

- What is TSC capable of on its own?

> It is a fully featured Turing complete language, but we don't have many flags to work with.
> It can do arbitrary math.
> Variables up to 8000 bits long (which would use every flag) are allowed.
> Money system is easily implemented, if you're smart.
> Exploding proximity bombs are possible with TSC.
> Tiles that break with different types of weapons other than just the missile launcher are possible by using the right entities, flags, and TSC.
> TSC can implement the portal gun's capabilities, including the part where you have a custom weapon creating portals. It cannot allow the player to maintain momentum through portals. However, you could have a large number of entity XXX on the map. Whenever you fire a bullet at entity XXX and kill it, it could use the boss flag 0x200 to trigger an open portal on the wall opposing the entity.

- Why are certain hacks harder than others?

> Hacks that are easy usually involve changing a constant (horizontal maximum speed hack, infinite booster fuel hack).
> Hacks that are hard change the way the engine runs (2x res hack, weapon hacks, NPC hacks).

- What can our editors do and not do?

> Modify map tiles and entities (Booster's Lab, CaveEditor, Sue's Workshop).
> Change bullet data and NPC table data (CaveEditor, WoC's NPCTBL editor, Booster's Lab?)
> Modify starting game settings, game title, format for images used in the game.
> Edit save files (SaveEditor, any hex editor)
> Cheat at the game in many ways.
> Modify embedded resources in the executable, add new music, add new graphics (ResourceHacker)
> Change key bindings (GRebind, any hex editor)
> Modify raw assembly code (OllyDbg)
> Compile text files with labels to native byte code. (Doukutsu Assembler)
> Do physics hacking (PhysicsEditor)

We cannot do the following...
> Compile C++, C, or Java to assembly code and then to native machine code.
> Pull out ORGs, drums, and embedded graphics so they are used as external files.
> Easily add a DLL to Cave Story.
> Do 2x Res without major hacking.
> Allow for 2 or more player characters simultaneously easily.
> Have networked online play.
> Use multiple threading easily in assembly code
> Edit behaviors of arbitrary TSC commands without using assembly.

-What resources and skills are required to change a certain aspect?

For "resources", see the response to editor capabilities.

> Adding ORGs: Composing ability or music copying ability.
> Adding Graphics: Artistic ability.
> TSC: Programming ability.
> Assembly: Expert programming ability.
> Map editing: Anyone can do this.
> NPC table editing : Anyone can do this.
> Save file editing: Anyone can do this.

-What would be a good 5th thing?

> How long does it take to complete any arbitrary modding task?
 
Nov 3, 2012 at 6:13 PM
Been here way too long...
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As an example of pure TSC being relatively powerful, see Noxid's Pyramid. Any enemies that die stay dead forever, and there are multiple different timers, as well as proximity triggers, modifying the map constantly on the way back up. No hacks involved.
 
Nov 3, 2012 at 7:06 PM
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