Fastest Possible Ballos Time

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Mar 17, 2018 at 11:28 PM
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What is the fastest possible time to beat the entire sacred grounds stuff
also i think time gets weird with frames per second so i'll talk about 50 frames per second

I'm not sure if it's best to use the spur or the machine gun or the snake
has anyone ever done this with that tool assisted stuff?


i thought that would be pretty neat to see
 
Mar 18, 2018 at 3:20 AM
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That would be this video of a 2'13"8:
It's also on the tribute site home page; just go to "fan works" click "high scores" and scroll down, should be there.
 
Mar 18, 2018 at 12:40 PM
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That would be this video of a 2'13"8:
It's also on the tribute site home page; just go to "fan works" click "high scores" and scroll down, should be there.
is that the fastest possible ever

like is that the perfect run
 
Mar 18, 2018 at 3:33 PM
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Just a random lurker, but that's definitely not "fastest possible." Humanly possible maybe.

I'm pretty sure nobody has made a Hell only TAS yet, but nitsuja's full game TAS that used machine gun, fireball, super missiles and blade at 6 HP managed to get 2'04"1. The author even mentioned a booster trick that can shave off more in-game time that wasn't used due to the run using real time. And that was 6 years ago too. So I'd imagine with a setup designed just to speedrun through Hell + frame perfect inputs and luck manipulation we'd get a sub 2'00"0 run.
 
Mar 18, 2018 at 4:17 PM
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i doubt there hasn't been a hell tas yet, in fact i swear i saw one back in the day. still, i don't think it's reasonable to assume that just because your speedrun is tool assisted, you have the fastest time. i'm sure there's plenty of room for optimization, so i don't believe that we can ever have an official "best time".
 
Mar 18, 2018 at 4:17 PM
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Just a random lurker, but that's definitely not "fastest possible." Humanly possible maybe.

I'm pretty sure nobody has made a Hell only TAS yet, but nitsuja's full game TAS that used machine gun, fireball, super missiles and blade at 6 HP managed to get 2'04"1. The author even mentioned a booster trick that can shave off more in-game time that wasn't used due to the run using real time. And that was 6 years ago too. So I'd imagine with a setup designed just to speedrun through Hell + frame perfect inputs and luck manipulation we'd get a sub 2'00"0 run.
i really want to see that
it would be really neat especially with those tricks like the level 3 blade going through walls and stuff
 
Mar 18, 2018 at 6:27 PM
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Just a random lurker, but that's definitely not "fastest possible." Humanly possible maybe.

I'm pretty sure nobody has made a Hell only TAS yet, but nitsuja's full game TAS that used machine gun, fireball, super missiles and blade at 6 HP managed to get 2'04"1. The author even mentioned a booster trick that can shave off more in-game time that wasn't used due to the run using real time. And that was 6 years ago too. So I'd imagine with a setup designed just to speedrun through Hell + frame perfect inputs and luck manipulation we'd get a sub 2'00"0 run.
I was answering to Walrus Guy saying:
...also i think time gets weird with frames per second so i'll talk about 50 frames per second...
I checked the tribute sites' high scores and for 50 fps, the one from nicovideo I found was apparently the fastest hell time with 50 fps. As for a TAS speedrun of hell, technically you can just find that from any full game speed run, and subtract the time.
While I don't think this run is the MOST perfect it is a pretty well commentated TAS of the game:
If you check the CCs, there's a well in-depth commentary which is awesome to read and see the inner-workings of what had to be done. Also the time for that TAS hell run - 50 fps- is 2'04"1.
 
Mar 18, 2018 at 8:57 PM
Spur is the best gun because its super cool
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I was answering to Walrus Guy saying:
I checked the tribute sites' high scores and for 50 fps, the one from nicovideo I found was apparently the fastest hell time with 50 fps. As for a TAS speedrun of hell, technically you can just find that from any full game speed run, and subtract the time.
While I don't think this run is the MOST perfect it is a pretty well commentated TAS of the game:
If you check the CCs, there's a well in-depth commentary which is awesome to read and see the inner-workings of what had to be done. Also the time for that TAS hell run - 50 fps- is 2'04"1.
I'm not sure about that though. What if they had the normal 50 health when starting, and also had weapons like bubbler for some reason or nemesis (if somehow that's better than blade?)
I feel like the TAS could go much faster then and maybe could have gone under 2 minutes with some shortcuts it could have taken




Also on a side note why do those TAS things get the fireball? it's not required, is it?
I know stuff like polar star is required (break through first cave blocks), and blade you have to get on the way out but I don't recall having to get that weapon to continue the game...
maybe i'm missing something
or maybe it's just a useful weapon
 
Mar 18, 2018 at 9:17 PM
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I'm not sure about that though. What if they had the normal 50 health when starting, and also had weapons like bubbler for some reason or nemesis (if somehow that's better than blade?)
I feel like the TAS could go much faster then and maybe could have gone under 2 minutes with some shortcuts it could have taken
Also on a side note why do those TAS things get the fireball? it's not required, is it?
I know stuff like polar star is required (break through first cave blocks), and blade you have to get on the way out but I don't recall having to get that weapon to continue the game...
maybe i'm missing something
or maybe it's just a useful weapon
Well by that point that's just cheating, the point of a TAS or speedrun in general is to get from the beginning of the game to the end in record time (sometimes varies based on rules). In Cave Story you're required to get the Polar Star, Fireball, and Blade; all of which you are forced to receive before advancing in the game. Without the Fireball you can't talk to Chako to activate the Jellyfish and get the Jellyfish juice to get past Chako's house. And the Blade you're required to get because you can't leave the Sand zone storehouse without, the game simply won't let you, and honestly why would you even if you could? The Blade's a great mid-game weapon prior to ones like the Super Missile Launcher and Spur. The Nemesis and Blade are both equally good for different reason; the Blade can wield high damage but the Nemesis has a great lvl 1 weapon and has good piercing, while I don't recommend a 3 hp run with the nemesis it'd be something interesting to see.
You're not allowed to just "get 50 hp" and "use shortcuts" because by that regard you can just set a command to teleport you to the end credits like in say Pokemon Gen 1 speed running (mostly Yellow), and unless there's a category for it, you can't sequence break Cave Story as part of the speedrun, that's cheating and can get your speedrun invalidated.
 
Mar 18, 2018 at 9:43 PM
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Well by that point that's just cheating, the point of a TAS or speedrun in general is to get from the beginning of the game to the end in record time (sometimes varies based on rules). In Cave Story you're required to get the Polar Star, Fireball, and Blade; all of which you are forced to receive before advancing in the game. Without the Fireball you can't talk to Chako to activate the Jellyfish and get the Jellyfish juice to get past Chako's house. And the Blade you're required to get because you can't leave the Sand zone storehouse without, the game simply won't let you, and honestly why would you even if you could? The Blade's a great mid-game weapon prior to ones like the Super Missile Launcher and Spur. The Nemesis and Blade are both equally good for different reason; the Blade can wield high damage but the Nemesis has a great lvl 1 weapon and has good piercing, while I don't recommend a 3 hp run with the nemesis it'd be something interesting to see.
You're not allowed to just "get 50 hp" and "use shortcuts" because by that regard you can just set a command to teleport you to the end credits like in say Pokemon Gen 1 speed running (mostly Yellow), and unless there's a category for it, you can't sequence break Cave Story as part of the speedrun, that's cheating and can get your speedrun invalidated.
oh i forgot that about the fireball
however i dont see how 50 hp is cheating since that's just the normal starting amount when you go into the sacred grounds. I was just wondering what would be the maximum time if on the rare chance you acted like a TAS perfectly with the normal setup instead of 6 health
 
Mar 18, 2018 at 10:37 PM
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oh i forgot that about the fireball
however i dont see how 50 hp is cheating since that's just the normal starting amount when you go into the sacred grounds. I was just wondering what would be the maximum time if on the rare chance you acted like a TAS perfectly with the normal setup instead of 6 health
Oh, my mistake; the reason the TAS has 6 hp is for the sake of optimizing the speedrun to maximize time, since a TAS can basically luck-manipulate hp, and that most attack do 5 damage and under, it's very complicated for a 6 hp TAS to maximize time saving but is helpful in getting hit in certain parts to get more damage during invincibility frames whilst healing in say the Core fight.
If we're talking about hell, yeah sure you can speedrun with the max of 50 hp; but that's only if you're just doing hell, if you're doing the entire game, it's better (for a TAS at least) to do 6 hp throughout the whole game, they have a bit of an unfair disadvantage if you're just talking about hell from a full speedrun. A TAS of hell, starting from hell would definitely have the TAS just simply abusing their 50 hp, life pot, etc.
 
Mar 18, 2018 at 10:41 PM
Spur is the best gun because its super cool
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Oh, my mistake; the reason the TAS has 6 hp is for the sake of optimizing the speedrun to maximize time, since a TAS can basically luck-manipulate hp, and that most attack do 5 damage and under, it's very complicated for a 6 hp TAS to maximize time saving but is helpful in getting hit in certain parts to get more damage during invincibility frames whilst healing in say the Core fight.
If we're talking about hell, yeah sure you can speedrun with the max of 50 hp; but that's only if you're just doing hell, if you're doing the entire game, it's better (for a TAS at least) to do 6 hp throughout the whole game, they have a bit of an unfair disadvantage if you're just talking about hell from a full speedrun. A TAS of hell, starting from hell would definitely have the TAS just simply abusing their 50 hp, life pot, etc.
yeah but wouldn't that be neat though
i wonder if anyone has done that yet


that would be kind of cool to see
 
Mar 25, 2018 at 7:47 PM
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The world record is 2:02:08, I think.
I can't find any time faster than that.
The person who made that time used the Spur, but the Snake is considered the best weapon for speedrunning Hell, due to the fact that you can use it to hit Deleets through the walls, although the Lv. 3 Blade also has the effect of going through walls.
(Well, the little slices do.)
 
Mar 25, 2018 at 9:51 PM
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The world record is 2:02:08, I think.
I can't find any time faster than that.
The person who made that time used the Spur, but the Snake is considered the best weapon for speedrunning Hell, due to the fact that you can use it to hit Deleets through the walls, although the Lv. 3 Blade also has the effect of going through walls.
(Well, the little slices do.)
I was just going off what Walrus said:
What is the fastest possible time to beat the entire sacred grounds stuff
also i think time gets weird with frames per second so i'll talk about 50 frames per second...
Whenever I posted about the other times, they were stuff for 50 fps Cave Story (Basically the freeware one) and that it for just hell. The 2'02"08 is CS+ which is 60 fps and doesn't technically count in terms of this thread.
Overall, yes it's the fastest (human done) run of hell but it's not 50 fps like Walrus asked for.
50fps and 60 fps make a huge difference.
 
Mar 25, 2018 at 9:53 PM
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I was just going off what Walrus said:

Whenever I posted about the other times, they were stuff for 50 fps Cave Story (Basically the freeware one) and that it for just hell. The 2'02"08 is CS+ which is 60 fps and doesn't technically count in terms of this thread.
Overall, yes it's the fastest (human done) run of hell but it's not 50 fps like Walrus asked for.
50fps and 60 fps make a huge difference.
is it possible to do 100fps?
 
Mar 25, 2018 at 9:55 PM
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