Ballos' return V4.75: Going through your past.

What do you mean?

 

I haven't played it yet but I certainly hope that by insane difficulty you don't mean rooms filled with spikes or ridiculously high boss health

Its only just a bunch of spikes everywhere. Also I don't even know how to change boss's health. If I could I would.

 

okay, so I tried your mod (version 1.0) and here's what I think...

Spoiler

I'm not saying this to be mean but it sucks, badly.


First of all you more then spammed the spike tiles and it made it equal death story.

Also, I couldn't even get to the first save and gave up after fifteen minutes. (The first fifteen minutes are the most critical for your mod and pretty much makes or breaks if someone will actually finish your mod)

I used the doukutsu trainer and almost cried because of how difficult you made the game. The second room looked like hell, and not in a good way either.

It looks like you didn't even test some parts of this mod, some of the jumps look impossible or require TAS perfection especially with how far apart you put the save disks.

Before the edited final cave, you have an option to take the booster 2.0 or not? It look impossible to beat without it.

The red demon battle it another cheap shot, all you did was limit the players movement.

The battle with misery and the invisible core that seemingly is unbeatable, looks just horrible with the level layout. it looks like it was made by a five year old with no sense of proper level layout. After that I had enough

Unless you were Shadow the Hedgehog or Chuck Norris, no one could ever complete this. People play games to have fun, not rage at mods that have poor level design.

Your mod is filled with fake difficulty, poor level design and not much more.

The only thing I liked was the misery battle with the tiles changed to the ones in the sacred grounds, but that's about it sadly...


That's all I have to say.

 

I reckon you should take a look at that video Matt posted, might want to take note of it. Just maaaaaaaaybe.
Personally, I can't stand Sue's Worskshop either, but but I'm not about to let that bias my opinion of the mod in general.
(Really? Downloading and extracting is THAT hard?)
I tried to do a commentary on this, but really, I spend about 15 minutes getting about nowhere, groaning like an idiot, so I ended up deleting the AVI anyway.

To recite what I remember from it, (and to also restate what Doors has been saying) here's what I can say about the mod:
Hard Level Design + cruel enemy placement ≠ Fair difficulty.
For one, the entire mod is incredibly slow-paced, with the player having to inch their way through room filled with insta-kill hazards on almost every single tile. As a result, this limits the player's mobility to a excruciatingly low amount. Forgive me for comparing this to the original Hell, but when it comes to hard levels (or mods in general), there has to be a certain balance.
In Running Hell, while the level is hard, you have room to move around, to maneuver and to avoid enemies and hazards. In Hell Challenge, there's barely any free space to move, without getting yourself killed. I would recommend: 1. Giving the player more space to move around, other than having spikes EVERYWHERE, thereby limiting their movement and slowing the pace of the mod and 2. Making the player better equipped.
If the primary argument against 2. is that it should be hard /in this way/, please don't. The reason why Running Hell was hard, but fair, was because Quote was at his prime by the time he reached it, with full health, the Booster for increased mobility, and the best weapons in the game. You're seriously limiting both Quote and the player here by only giving them 3 HP, the Whimsical Star (Which in this circumstance is utterly useless), and the Polar Star.
As for putting spikes everywhere, that's essentially fake difficulty. There's little-to-no room for learning, much less little-to-no room at all, really. Either give them player more health, a way to avoid said spikes, or remove some altogether.
These are just some minor things I found in the mod, not regarding difficulty, so these really should be fixed from a technical standpoint.
- The first chest you see remains closed, even after you remove the contents.
- Gestation is a really unfitting theme to a Hell level, even if it is the first room.
I didn't make it through this mod, because it just didn't keep my interests for long enough.
Sorry if this came across as cruel, and I don't mean any personal harm, just that this mod, as of now, needs quite some changes to be made before it can be considered enjoyable.

 

okay, so I tried your mod (version 1.0) and here's what I think...

Spoiler

I'm not saying this to be mean but it sucks, badly.


First of all you more then spammed the spike tiles and it made it equal death story.

Also, I couldn't even get to the first save and gave up after fifteen minutes. (The first fifteen minutes are the most critical for your mod and pretty much makes or breaks if someone will actually finish your mod)

I used the doukutsu trainer and almost cried because of how difficult you made the game. The second room looked like hell, and not in a good way either.

It looks like you didn't even test some parts of this mod, some of the jumps look impossible or require TAS perfection especially with how far apart you put the save disks.

Before the edited final cave, you have an option to take the booster 2.0 or not? It look impossible to beat without it.

The red demon battle it another cheap shot, all you did was limit the players movement.

The battle with misery and the invisible core that seemingly is unbeatable, looks just horrible with the level layout. it looks like it was made by a five year old with no sense of proper level layout. After that I had enough

Unless you were Shadow the Hedgehog or Chuck Norris, no one could ever complete this. People play games to have fun, not rage at mods that have poor level design.

Your mod is filled with fake difficulty, poor level design and not much more.

The only thing I liked was the misery battle with the tiles changed to the ones in the sacred grounds, but that's about it sadly...


That's all I have to say.

I reckon you should take a look at that video Matt posted, might want to take note of it. Just maaaaaaaaybe.
Personally, I can't stand Sue's Worskshop either, but but I'm not about to let that bias my opinion of the mod in general.
(Really? Downloading and extracting is THAT hard?)
I tried to do a commentary on this, but really, I spend about 15 minutes getting about nowhere, groaning like an idiot, so I ended up deleting the AVI anyway.

To recite what I remember from it, (and to also restate what Doors has been saying) here's what I can say about the mod:
Hard Level Design + cruel enemy placement ≠ Fair difficulty.
For one, the entire mod is incredibly slow-paced, with the player having to inch their way through room filled with insta-kill hazards on almost every single tile. As a result, this limits the player's mobility to a excruciatingly low amount. Forgive me for comparing this to the original Hell, but when it comes to hard levels (or mods in general), there has to be a certain balance.
In Running Hell, while the level is hard, you have room to move around, to maneuver and to avoid enemies and hazards. In Hell Challenge, there's barely any free space to move, without getting yourself killed. I would recommend: 1. Giving the player more space to move around, other than having spikes EVERYWHERE, thereby limiting their movement and slowing the pace of the mod and 2. Making the player better equipped.
If the primary argument against 2. is that it should be hard /in this way/, please don't. The reason why Running Hell was hard, but fair, was because Quote was at his prime by the time he reached it, with full health, the Booster for increased mobility, and the best weapons in the game. You're seriously limiting both Quote and the player here by only giving them 3 HP, the Whimsical Star (Which in this circumstance is utterly useless), and the Polar Star.
As for putting spikes everywhere, that's essentially fake difficulty. There's little-to-no room for learning, much less little-to-no room at all, really. Either give them player more health, a way to avoid said spikes, or remove some altogether.
These are just some minor things I found in the mod, not regarding difficulty, so these really should be fixed from a technical standpoint.
- The first chest you see remains closed, even after you remove the contents.
- Gestation is a really unfitting theme to a Hell level, even if it is the first room.
I didn't make it through this mod, because it just didn't keep my interests for long enough.
Sorry if this came across as cruel, and I don't mean any personal harm, just that this mod, as of now, needs quite some changes to be made before it can be considered enjoyable.

Well I'm sorry if 1.SW is horrible. 2.WHY ELSE IS IT CALLED HELL CHALLENGE! 3.If you rage quit that's not my problem. 4.That was the whole point of the red demon fight to limit your movements so that you can figure out a pattern to kill him with. 5.I've tested every jump. 6.I don't know how to change the music could you tell me how to? 7.That was the point to limit Quote to a state of insanity to the controller. 8.Did I say this was in anyway not impossible. 9.(I'm running out of things to say gosh.)Again that was the point to make you look around for the enemy patterns so you can be ready when it happens. 10.If I remove some spikes altogether it would probably mean about a week or 2 more of testing. 11."...for the sane, and "INSANE".....". I have finally made an ending for this game for those who have still stayed the whole way for it (idioticbaka). Incase you at least want to see the ending, it will be out very soon, THERE ARE YOU HAPPY NOW!
For my next mod it will be made using BL, and CE. And no it will be a different mod that doesn't involve in anyway being a "Hell Challenge".

 

God I wish I could punch you through my screen

 

Can someone like Noxid or Doublethink shut down the comments section plz!!!
Either way its not like I'm forcing to complete my mod.

 

If you're not going to accept criticism then don't post the fucking mod
Listen to the people who have been modding longer than you or at least that want to play your mod without having to be hardcore fucking gods

 

Well I'm sorry if 1.SW is horrible.

I never brought up SW, you can get the same quality of mod content out of BL and CE.



In fact there are a few good SW mods out there.

2.WHY ELSE IS IT CALLED HELL CHALLENGE!

BECAUSE IT SHOULD BE A CHALLENGE NOT DEATH STORY II.

3.If you rage quit that's not my problem.

I never said that I raged, I'm saying that others would and if it's their problem then they don't need to play your mod.



(Isn't the reason you mod to make you/others happier then when the started?)

4.That was the whole point of the red demon fight to limit your movements so that you can figure out a pattern to kill him with.

Yeah, but it's cheap difficulty, even making two of them would be less cheap then limiting movement.

5.I've tested every jump.

Okay then, my apologies. It just looked impossible because it's sooooo hard.

6.I don't know how to change the music could you tell me how to?

<CMUXXXX

7.That was the point to limit Quote to a state of insanity to the controller.

You are trying to make the player go insane? (tough selling point imo)

8.Did I say this was in anyway not impossible.

No...



It's impossible then?

9.(I'm running out of things to say gosh.)Again that was the point to make you look around for the enemy patterns so you can be ready when it happens.

Yeah, but you can't even see them because they are the came color as the bk.

10.If I remove some spikes altogether it would probably mean about a week or 2 more of testing.

That's called making a decent product.



how many updates have I posted for Suu No Monogatari since you've joined the CSTSF?



one.

11."...for the sane, and "INSANE".....". I have finally made an ending for this game for those who have still stayed the whole way for it (idioticbaka). Incase you at least want to see the ending, it will be out very soon, THERE ARE YOU HAPPY NOW!

I highly doubt it's for the sane.



It's not for me. (in it's current state that is)



And I'm (still) sane.



and no, I'm not.



The thing I hate the most it rushed, bad content.

For my next mod it will be made using BL, and CE. And no it will be a different mod that doesn't involve in anyway being a "Hell Challenge".

I already knew this.



It's not that it makes much difference if the outcome is a good product.

 

Okay, okay.

I guess I'll be the one to stream this thing later. Maybe start at around 4:00~4:30PM PST and such?

 

Everyone else is right, Callerloppy. It'd make a bit of sense if you hadn't played other mods before making one, but when people tell you that it's comparable to death story, then you know you did something wrong. Sometimes, the mods that take the longest to make are the best mods out there, instead of mods crapped out in a few days. (No Story Just Cave is an exception, as it's a great mod made in 5 days.)

@Jon: Yeah, you should totally stream it. Show Callerloppy how hard it must be if people's comparing it to death story.

 

I've never played any other mods that are similar to CS (example: WTF story) at all up in till now. I wanted to make a mod harder then WTF story and so mission accomplished.

 

Okay look. If I made a mod wherein you entered a door and there were -127 spikes under you requiring you to break the game's physics and jump as soon as the stage loaded but before the game rendered you were in mid-air, then it too would be harder than WTF Story.

As such, I will be releasing such a mod soon, and it will be known as the greatest mod ever.

 

Because using fake difficulty is how mods are made... (Not.)
WTF Story is hard in a special way: Great enemy placements, strong weapons, nice designs, health upgrades, ect, so there's no fake difficulty there, just pure difficulty and skill.
Spikes are not the way to go, UNLESS you use them sparingly in where skill instead of precise, TAS-like movement isn't needed.

@Zarro: Is doing that even possible?

 

Ok cool, and could someone give a link to the stream?

 

Jon said 4:00 - 4:30 PST. It's 3:51 PST. Jon'll most likely post a link to it here when he starts, anyways.

 

Ok cool, and could someone give a link to the stream?

The stream link is in my signature, but I'll post it here for Convenience's sake.

http://www.livestream.com/spidersstreams?t=171482

Oh and just to note, there will be a bit of Mic commentary, and a break or two might happen, since family stuff is happening over here.

 

I didn't know I was that much of a horrible moder.

 

Okay, the Stream is starting now. Come and watch. See how many times I die. Count with me. Maybe.

http://www.livestream.com/spidersstreams?t=171482

 

I didn't know I was that much of a horrible moder.

Well you are. But we gave a lot of constructive criticism on why you are. So your next mod won't have fake difficulty, unfitting music, painful backgrounds and other things. So by the time you make your next mod, you'll probably be significantly less horrible.