41 replies to this topic

[HaydenStudios]

I know that this was briefly brought up in this thread, but there was only the slightest bit of mention about it.

So how exactly were the Colons' parents killed?

It seemed obvious to me at first that it was just some killer robot that killed their mother,

Our real mommies were killed by robots. We hadn't even opened our eyes yet... But Curly raised us.

but then came along the NICALiS translation in which

Our mother was killed by the robot. Now she's raising us.

Which implies that Curly killed the Colon's mother.

Now of course one could argue that the NICALiS translation is correct because it's declared official, and that even Pixel himself approved of it- But I think that's a big load of politically correct crap for two reasons:

1) Last I heard, Pixel's English isn't all that good, so how good of a job would he be able to do of judging which translation is better?

2) Some of the parts of the NICALiS translation are just so retarded and dry compared to the elegantly worded parts of the AGTP translation.

Spoiler

Your tie to Curly Brace, the only warrior you would trust your back to. Surely you will meet again one day...

Your connection to Curly Brace, the only person you trust. You'll see each other again...

I'm truly sorry for the chaos that has befallen your island. We humans must take the blame.

I'm sorry. We've ruined your island. We humans are evil.

And with that, someone could argue that the Aeon Genesis translation is correct.

Now while it may be a bit grim dark that Curly killed the Colons' parents, the mother/father could have been enraged by red flowers. In fact, there's even a Japanese mod called Iron Bond that's basically Curly Brace's side of the events of Cave Story that involves Curly killing the Colons' mother and getting the Colons entrusted to her. That would insinuate that the NICALiS translation is correct, and the evidence would start to pile up in favor of that theory. The only real argument to that that I can think of is pointing out that Kaeso made an English mod that was Curly's side of the events, and that it involved killing the Colons' father and getting the Colons entrusted to her for having mercy on him. Even more evidence that the NICALiS translation is correct, right? Wrong! Kaeso admitted that the only reason he/she made the mod that way was because it was more dramatic:

Spoiler

Curly, if i remember correctly, woke up with the mimiga's.

Maybe, but it just seems so much more dramatic the way I did it There's going to be a lot that may not seem related to the story and there will be a lot that does. I'm a firm believer of not sacrificing game play for realism.

The first release with that scene came along before the NICALiS translation even existed, and Kaeso was basing this off of the AGTP translation which said some other robot killed their mother. With this, one could argue that the creator of Iron Bond had a similar thought process.

One could even say that neither translations are correct, as the line spoken by that Colon could be like the line spoken by Misery offering to eat a red flower in the AGTP translation, but in the NICALiS translation asking the Doctor if he wants to eat one. But due to the extremely context-sensitive nature of the Japanese language, it's hard to say either of them are correct, as the literal meaning of Misery's line is "My lord... Eat one?" If only there was someone here who knew Japanese that could tell us if there's something similar to that going on... *cough*GIRakaCHEEZER*cough*

[hate9]

I think quote killed them.

[cultr1]

Well it depends on if Curly and Quote hung out all the time. I'd say it was most likely Curly, since she woke up surrounded by the Colons, it doesn't seem like there's much room for anything else to happen.

On the subject of the Aeon Genesis translation, it is a well-written but highly inaccurate one. Numerous liberties were taken during the translations, and frequently there are mistranslations or things left out because of the difficulty of translation. Go ahead and run through the NiCALIS translation, and you'll see several things that weren't in the AG translation. This was a professionally done translation run by Pixel himself (his English isn't stellar, but I'm sure if they have a way of translating Japanese then they have a way to easily communicate with him).

[Moon]

I think it's Miakid's goons.
Literal japanese translation always use "the" because they apparently don't have quantitative titles. So "the" robot can be "a" robot for all we know.

[onlineworms]

Almost saw a motherf@cker in the title. *cough*
Well, I think doctor killed their parents.

[GIRakaCHEEZER]

Alright I'll do my best to provide the most literal translation of the original text here:

"Our real mama was killed by the robot(s)." (Robot isn't specified as singular/plural here)

"The one who had raised us when hadn't even opened our eyes was her."
So it seems to be a bit ambiguous in the original, since "her" could refer to the robot, or it could refer to Curly beside him, or both.

[andwhyisit]

"The one who had raised us when hadn't even opened our eyes was her."
So it seems to be a bit ambiguous in the original, since "her" could refer to the robot, or it could refer to Curly beside him, or both.

You could argue that the official translation uses the same ambiguity in their use of the word "she".

[Jesvice]

that same Colon said:

Our mother was killed by the robot. Now she's raising us.
Which implies that Curly killed the Colon's mother.

no no no hayden no that is definitely not being implied.

would you happily let someone raise you if they killed your mother?

you're just reading it wrong the Colon was just pointing out two different things.

That a robot killed their mother, and that Curley was raising them.

[X-Calibar]

no no no hayden no that is definitely not being implied.

would you happily let someone raise you if they killed your mother?

you're just reading it wrong the Colon was just pointing out two different things.

That a robot killed their mother, and that Curley was raising them.

Can you really blame Curly if she did do it? If she was once just a programmed killer robot with no free will.
Or if their parents were Frenzied from the Red Flower? She raised them and protected them, and told them the truth from the get-go... (They were just babies when they lost their parents so...)

But in any case :
I'm Curly Brace.
I've been with these little-
ones since before I can-
remember.
I don't recall anything-
before that...
Apparently, it's so-called-
memory loss.
I may have been a Mimiga-
killer, just like the other-
robots...

It doesn't seem like Curly killed their parents. Or at least she doesn't remember it.
The children say something to the extent of just being babies when Curly woke up with them...

,.. Wait... she says "I've been with these little ones since >>before<< I can remember."
That *could* mean the little ones *could* remember more than she does...

But in the original translation :
"When I woke up, I was with these children. I don't have any memories before that... Amnesia, you might say. I was... probably a Mimiga-butcher just like the other robots..."
Which suggests she'd remember more than the little Mimigas.

@GIR's translation -
In the end, I'd like to think some other robots did it. But, it's not necessarily true. She could have been put in a situation like Quote was with Toroko...

[Duke Serkol]

It seemed obvious to me at first that it was just some killer robot that killed their mother,
but then came along the NICALiS translation in whichWhich implies that Curly killed the Colon's mother.

Not only that, if you notice, in AG's translation the Colon speaks of mommies, implying they are not all siblings, whereas in the Nicalis one they clearly are as only one mother is referenced for them all.

One could even say that neither translations are correct

You mean, it could even be that neither translation is correct...

Alright I'll do my best to provide the most literal translation of the original text here:

"Our real mama was killed by the robot(s)." (Robot isn't specified as singular/plural here)

"The one who had raised us when hadn't even opened our eyes was her."
So it seems to be a bit ambiguous in the original, since "her" could refer to the robot, or it could refer to Curly beside him, or both.

...aaaaaand that's exactly the case. Neither seems necessarily right or wrong. Yay -_-

At any rate, thanks for checking it out Gir!

Say, is at least "mama" specified as singular?
Also, seeing as robot is not specified if singular or plural, perhaps it would be best to potentially omit the article? That is, "killed by (the) robot(s)" instead of "killed by the robot(s)."

You could argue that the official translation uses the same ambiguity in their use of the word "she".

Yeah, that it does.

would you happily let someone raise you if they killed your mother?

If at the time you hadn't even opened your eyes yet (let alone knew what was going on and were yet to learn how to speak) and ever since then, from as long back as you can recall, this person had shown you nothing but kindness and care?
Yeah, you just might.
The person that actually raised you is going to have a stronger emotional connection than the one that gave you birth if you never knew her. After all the Colons don't have TV or much of a social life to help contextualize things. Curly is literally all they have and if the notion that she's killed their real mother has been known to them since they were very little, it's going to be just a fact of life to them.

you're just reading it wrong the Colon was just pointing out two different things.

That a robot killed their mother, and that Curley was raising them.

But in the Nicalis translation it was "THE robot" not "A robot". The only robot being discussed in the conversation is Curly, so yes, the Nicalis translation does imply she killed their mother.

Can you really blame Curly if she did do it? If she was once just a programmed killer robot with no free will.
Or if their parents were Frenzied from the Red Flower?

She definitely didn't do it because of her programming, when she regains her memory she's relieved to find out that she and Quote were never killer robots, that they were sent to the island with the mission of destroying the crown.
So if she did do it, it was probably because of red flower rage.

.. Wait... she says "I've been with these little ones since >>before<< I can remember."
That *could* mean the little ones *could* remember more than she does...

But in the original translation :
"When I woke up, I was with these children. I don't have any memories before that... Amnesia, you might say. I was... probably a Mimiga-butcher just like the other robots..."
Which suggests she'd remember more than the little Mimigas.

Oh boy... GIR! We need you again! *lol*

Edited by Duke Serkol, 13 July 2012 - 03:13 PM.